The guest grew up in Leytonstone, living on Acacia Road, and recalls a childhood split between local streets and school pitches. He says he moved into a role as a paid protector at secondary school, later left home at 15 to share a flat, and played district football against players who went on to the pros.
Paid protection and school trouble
He describes how, at secondary school, he started intervening when other pupils were being picked on and ended up being paid by some peers for protection. He emphasises that he didn’t see himself as a thief or a bully in the same way as others, but that taking on that role led to trouble with staff and parents.
The interview also contains conflicting accounts about formal discipline. At points the host frames the episode as an expulsion for what sounded like extortion or ‘borrowing’ from classmates; the guest later says he didn’t actually get expelled and that the situation is more complicated. The contradiction remains in the record.
Leaving home at 15
Around 15, the guest explains, he and a group of friends left their parents’ homes and moved into a flat together. He says a family acquaintance provided the flat in Stoneywell and Church Street so the group could have more independence.
He places those moves in the context of his local neighbourhood: he grew up on Acacia Road in Leytonstone and had connections across nearby areas. The change to independent living coincided with a decline in formal schooling; after 15 he did not continue in the usual way through to GCSE years.
Football, an injury and David Beckham
Football was a big part of his youth. He played for local Sunday sides and his district team, and remembers playing with and against players who later became professionals.
He says he suffered an overuse injury—referred to in the conversation as 'Osgood’s Cloriasis'—which prevented him from continuing on the path he’d hoped for. He also recalls a memorable school cup final: he claims he scored four in a 4–3 win in which the opposing side’s star scored a hat-trick; among those opponents was a young David Beckham, whom the guest says he played with and against.
What came next at 16
With football curtailed by injury and the pull of money and independence, he says his attention turned to informal hustles and other ways to earn — partly to buy clothes and things his family couldn’t afford. He stresses that school still mattered to him socially, even as his priorities changed.
Throughout the conversation he frames those teenage years as a mix of community ties and small-time enterprise — a time when the neighbourhood, friendships and practical survival increasingly shaped everyday choices.
Adapted from this guest conversation with AI assistance. Each person’s experiences remain their own. The video is the original conversation.
Read the video transcript +
Back to where we were because there was a bad problem with the air conditioning, 100%. So yeah, back to what I'm saying to you. So basically I was trying to say to you now, you got, I'm assuming the kids, the guy that was bothering the kids, they wasn't taking their stuff. They was basically beating them up. No, people used to get like, look, look, look. I'm not one, I never had lunch money and I never had pocket money. Yeah? Mainly to that, yeah? But then you had other kids who were more fortunate and they used to get lunch money. They used to get, I was on, but then they get pocket money. You get what I'm saying? Which was something. But then you had other guys or kids like me who didn't and they might just see it to take people's things. I wasn't really one to take people's things. I was more, I had friends that maybe might take me McDonald's and buy me, give me money to go with the thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You understand? But I'm then saying there was other people outside my friendship circle that people would trouble them. If I saw it and it was like in front of me enough, all right, that's a little bit unjust or like I didn't like the person that was doing it anyway. I might just intervene in it. And then people would pay me for the privilege in it. I understand what you're trying to get to and say like, what's the difference between me and them and me and them? But I wasn't just taking set on people with it. And then if I was putting myself in the line and someone was paying me for that, I didn't really see nothing wrong. Maybe my senses and my thinking was a little bit warped anyway. That's why I was getting it. Right. So this is where we're going to get to the point. So you've been expelled now. So under this, you got expelled basically for, was you expelled for bullying? Because I remember the point is, what did you get expelled for? I know you was borrowing people's money and stuff. They kind of said, because there was more people. It wasn't just one. A few people have come along and said. Maybe was getting maybe like 70, 80 quid a week. So I might have had eight of my peers paying me for protection. All right then, cool, cool. And then what it was is everyone was fine to do it. But then when obviously the guy's computer, his mum and parents had to come to the school. They've given it to Dan Robinson, the computer. There's no return and no computer. I couldn't get the computer back. Right. So what I'm going to say now, yeah. So the conclusion of that primary school thing is, so once you went to, so what I'm saying, so remember you've been given a report. Yeah. You've been expelled for basically being, what would they say, borrowing, extortion, whatever your word in this call. But it sounds a bit wrong. Yeah. Cool. So what I'm looking at. I'd say it was wrong anyway. Right. So what I'm looking at now then, I'm saying to you, so from primary school, you played up, you was a year, you was a couple of years above in it. Because remember you played in goal. As you said, you played in goal. Yeah. Yeah. I always, I grew up on an estate in Leeds. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I was always with older kids.
I'm talking to remember, sometimes we're gonna go back to the time when you was getting told like you're five, you're six, nine you're in goal. So you was maybe tall, you was equipped to play with the older boys. Then with your experience where you let me know when you was on an estate call. Now from then, nothing was really going on in primary school from what I'm hearing yeah? And then you get to secondary school, remember it's only your first year in secondary school yeah? And then bam, straight away you're being a protector yeah? For people that you assume, let me finish, the people that you assume are vulnerable people yeah? That's what you're saying to me. Well I would have assumed they were vulnerable. Well you said listen. But like they turned out to be vulnerable. And another thing, not vulnerable, not vulnerable, not vulnerable. They was well off. They was well off. But they was, oh yeah, so where you was coming from, heard, never really had a few things. Remember like, let me just say like this as well, like Leytonstone's kind of got like two sides. So you've got the council estate side of Leytonstone where the cattles, even the little housing estates where I lived on the thing, like Acacia Road, you understand that was like a little estate. Then you've got the cattle, then you've got Thatcher's. That's like Leytonstone. But why are we saying two, see what I'm saying? So what I'm saying to you, that's me listening to you as an 11, 12 year old person, yeah? Cool. How many areas have you lived in? What do you mean how many areas? How many areas? From the time of you being born. Oh, areas. You went to Walthamstow, you told me, and you went to Leytonstone. While I was still at school, me and my friend. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I'm not even trusting you. We lived at Stone, you know. I lived in Stone, you know. I've lived in... No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Listen, we're not going to... I need to be up to speed with you because you're moving fast. I'm just getting into Tom Wood. Hear what I'm saying to you? You're telling me about... You said how many areas? No, no, no, no, no, no, no. So at that stage, how many areas have I lived in? Listen to what I'm saying to you. Just try and listen to what I'm saying. Go on, yeah? I'm asking you simple questions, yeah? Bam, you're 12, 13. Hear me out. You've been expelled. So when you get expelled, you go to Tom Wood. For such a young person... I'm having a conversation, but you're telling me about Leytonstone, housing estates, so many things. No, hear me out. I want to know... That's what I'm saying to you. Hear me out. No, no, no, no, no, no. What I'm trying to say, if anyone's listening to you, they want to know... Remember, I'm trying to get to big up your thing, 100%. Darren Robinson, yeah? Also known as Steps Unit. You're older than me, innit? So I've grown, innit? And I might have heard about you, but I don't know everything about you. Let's get that out of there, straight away. So for you to be talking to me, I might have known you 20 years later, for instance, yeah? You're coming, like you're going to... Boom, boom. Hear me out. So what I'm saying to you, simple, you're living in Leytonstone in a flat. Yeah. Right, in a flat on cattle, thatch house. Nah, I'm living in a case of...
Which is like five minutes from Cowell. So are we going to be correct then? Once again, once again, once again, I want to know where you, your brother, because I know you had twins, but they didn't live, rest in peace your brother, yeah? Because I'm listening to what you're saying to me. Did you live in Acacia Road or did you live in Thatch House? I lived in Acacia Road. Right, so let me leave that straight. So if I know Leytonstone, because I know Leytonstone, Acacia Road will come up. Where did you get Thatch House from though? Because you said Thatch House in Cowell. You started talking about states. That's where I'm going from. Yeah, okay. 100%. You told me about that. I didn't know. It was like I lived on Thatch House and Cowell. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. You're going, no, listen. But with my mum, I lived in Acacia Road. Right, so listen to what I'm saying to you. And my brother, my brother's husband. Let me get one thing straight now. You go home from school. Yeah. And maybe you go to your mates house on an estate. Hear me out. Where do you have your breakfast in the morning normally when you was 12? Yeah, whatever that breakfast, man. Yeah. In Acacia Road. Right, so without getting anywhere else. Because do you appreciate where you lived or did you want to live in the estate? Well, I don't know. I liked where I lived. I wouldn't have minded living on the estate. Right, cool. So what I'm trying to say, because we have to differentiate something here quickly. Just on the normal one. So the house was fine where you was living. That's what I'm trying to say. Lovely house. Mum, sweet. Lovely, yeah. Lovely, perfect. So yeah, you get to Tom Wood now, yeah? Yeah. Because remember when I first saw. I should have really gone there. But the reason I didn't go there is because I knew a lot of the people that went there anyway. But watch this now. I'll hear you. So your mum was trying to protect you. There was a little bit of that. My mum really didn't want me to go to the same school as one of my friends that I used to get in a lot of trouble with for fighting. Before. Wait, wait, wait. Stop there. Because this is something I'm learning. So you're getting into fights in primary school. Yeah, we used to go to like secondary schools. Yeah, we was like fourth years. So like 10, 11. We used to go to secondary schools and fight people that were up to like first year, second year, third year. So you're like, you're punching above your weight then? Yeah, we used to like. No, you. Yeah. And your squad. Not my squad. At the time I had like my best friend. Yeah. Yeah, at school. Who's your best friend? That was Andre Roach. Yeah. Okay. And rest in peace. Come on, come on, man. You're the man behind the scenes. You can't be. The man behind trying to sleep. I love it. He kept them open. Watch that though. Chris Roach. Yeah. Chris Roach. Like he is another. Like he, that man was scoffing. Right. So watch this. 100%. Respect your bridging in there. Yeah, but we come from that era. That's the era we come from before all this knives. Right, right, right. Even before the guns and that. Boom. Yeah, I love you still. Big up. You got energy. In Tom Wood school. Yeah. Was the same occurrence happening basically? When you went to Tom Wood school.
Was you doing the same things what you was doing in Leytonstone? Nah, not really. But you said in the beginning, you said you didn't finish school. Nah, not really, that was a little protection racket, that was done. That stopped. So now you've gone back to school, like Tom Wood, where you wanted to go originally. No, where I should have gone originally. Well, not should have, because they sent you to the other school. Your mum kept you, oh, you opted. I opted to go, because like I said, your friend that he was with, we used to go to other schools, senior, secondary schools. We know that. And we got in other little troubles at school, yeah? Behaviour stuff. So our mums, both of our mums, my mum said she didn't really want me to go to secondary school with him, and his mum said he didn't. Right, but what I'm going to say to you, the conclusion, though, you see the conclusion. We both lied to each other, I said I was going to Tom Wood, he said he was going to New London, where his older brother, rest in peace, used to go, New London Boys, yeah? And then on the first day of school, we both met at the bus stop in our Leytonstone school uniforms. So you both went to Leytonstone then? Yeah. He got excluded before me. Right, but then you end up in Tom Wood. Right, so you end up in Tom Wood. What was your duration of years in Tom Wood? Because you said that you didn't last school. Yeah, but that was issues outside school. Like I had like one little incident in school where I got suspended, but I used to love school, you know? Like school was like, yeah, it was the place to be in it. I had little hustles going on, so I was getting money, I needed to be at school. Yeah, little stuff. See school, as long as I know school, yeah? The girls I can relate to. School is to go to go there, go and do maths, English, humanities, science, and so on and so on. So when you're going somewhere, like you're doing your little racketeering, you're doing all sorts of stuff before school, after school. Why did you get expelled from Tom Hood? I didn't get expelled. So you just didn't turn up? No, what happened was I left home. When did you leave home? 15. So you've left home at 15, you're not attending school now? No, I was attending school. So me and my bredren, yeah? We, my bredren Gary Tomlin, renowned chef, he's also the... No, no, bro, listen, I want to know, no, no, no. I just need to know when you... A group of us left home that was going to school. A little syndicate of boys and girls. We all left home, yeah? And then Gary's dad was emigrating to Jamaica. No, big man, no. I want to know, no, no, no. Listen, bro, I'm going to tell you. So he gave us a flat in Stoneywell and Church Street. Right, and you're 15? Yes, I was 15. This is what happens. See, I'm not sure about the schooling now, but in my...
So you go first year, second year, third year. That's called secondary school. Then you'd go fourth year, fifth year, and if you were going further, up a sixth or sixth form, right? But when that was the schooling kind of system, right up until I went to secondary school, yeah, at age 11, which would be first year, now I believe it's year 11. It's all the same. We go up at 11. It's going to not change the days. I don't know what it is. But when you're 11, you go into the first year. Yeah, depending on what age you are and what year you're born in and so on and so on. So when I started going into the first year, the whole school went from 11 to 16. So you go to one secondary school and stay there until you leave school. When did you never go back to Tomwood? When did you leave secondary school for good? Oh, yeah. The only option you can do now is either go sixth form college, which is 16 plus, or you can go to any college. When did you forget Tomwood so I can get that out of you? Because I'm struggling to get that out of you. Yeah, 1999. And what age would you have been? 15. So from 15, there's no more school. There's no more popping in. There's no more nothing, Skanna. Cool. And if I'm getting the right information, I don't want to talk on you. You didn't get expelled. You just kind of got moved from your mum's house. You and your bredren, your daddy, your bredren's dad give up a flat, give you lot freedom because you lot think you're all big men because you're all moving a bit mature, so on and so on. And you're living in Hackney. Now if I know where you live now, where you lived then, because I know the area because you told me you grew up on Acacia Road. Forget Tomwood from Acacia Road was maybe 10 minutes, 20 minutes, 5 minutes on the bus, give or take. Watch this. No, Tomwood, that's three minutes. Oh, it's on the road? Yeah, yeah. So five minutes. So straight away, I've lived in Stoughton. So straight away I'm saying, right, so to go from Stoughton now to school, where you've got issues anyway, you're taking yourself miles away now, yes? Nah, it wasn't that long. It wasn't that long because all the traffic is coming the other way on... Oh gosh, but you walked five seconds to the school, but nah, Stoughton is not that far. No problem. I prefer to be Acacia Road guy in Tomwood. That was kind of like what it could be. It was fun. So 15, you're 15. You're doing a little racketeering in school. Had been, yeah. You had been doing racketeering because it changed. Maybe you went and met more hard nuts in Tomwood where you couldn't racketeer. Maybe that's the reason why. There was other little... You're doing other things outside of school then, cool. And so basically, let me try and cheat then. I'm going to say, I'm going to be like, say you're 13, 14, yeah? Yeah. Because if in between that time you're only popped in the night, girls, boom, boom, boom, yeah? So sweet. Now let me just delve into that little relationship there. So you're 15, you're on the road, you're entertaining women, girls, cool, yeah? And then
Oh, Gads, are you saying, well, you didn't do your exams? Did you do your exams?
I've done... Nah. You didn't do no exams? So you did attend? I've done, I think, one, which was child development. Child development, and I would've... Can I help you? Can I help you out now? Can I help you out? Child development. See, any child development courses means you're struggling with certain things. No, child development then was like cooking. Cooking, like some... Oh, yeah, yeah, cookery. Basically, all the gal in my year was doing child development. Yeah, so you did cookery. And then I opted, that was one of my options, and I was like the only boy in the class, innit? So, 15, you're out of school. Yeah, you're out of school. Are you planning, are you trying to attend college, or is your mum trying to put you to college? Are you planning on colleges? Did you go to college? Nah, at first, yeah. Like, I didn't, like, do you know what it was? I always thought I was going to be a professional footballer. So, at 15, you thought you was going to be a professional footballer? Yeah, then I got an injury. Basically, I got a thing called... Yeah, then I got an injury. Basically, I got a thing called Osgood's Cloriasis, yeah? And it's where your bones are going too fast, and then they're rubbing, and I was unable to play football. That kind of, like, made me kind of delve, like, that kind of, like, where I wasn't playing football, yeah? And I couldn't play football. Kind of, I put my energies and my things into other kind of avenues. Cool, so, your football was, what is that, what was your, what was your, what team, big team, local team? Nah, I didn't, well, this is what I'm saying. I played for, like, Wolfram Forest Youth and New Forest Youth. They were, like, the Sunday teams. But I played for my district team, my school district team. And that had a few, do you know what I'm saying, professionals that fought it from there. So, obviously, the one who reached the highest heights, that was David Beckham. We had Jason Brissier. He was a professional, but he didn't reach the heights. Oh, you played with all of them guys? Chris Day, who was a goalkeeper. Oh, you played with all of them? Yeah, they was all in my year. You said David Beckham, was you playing with him? Yeah, played with him and played against him, yeah. Okay, was you on the same level as Beckham? If you go back them days, could you, so you thought you could make it, so why he made it? Me, personally, me, personally, I thought I'd better, I'd better than Beckham. But he couldn't bend it like him, I was joking. I could do, I could bend it. No, no, I was joking. But what it was is, the first time I ever remember playing against him, or it was highlighted that I was playing against him, was for Tom Hood. Yeah, and previously, Tom Hood was, football team was dead. When I was at Leyton Stone, we used to thrash Tom Hood. And when I went to Tom Hood, we turned into a champion's side, immediately.
So basically, my PE teacher, he was the district manager, Mr. Brown, John Brown. Anyway, him, he's going, listen, we're going to play against this kid today, David Beckham. He can put the ball on a 50 pence base from 50 yards. I remember that like it was just like something just gone. That's what he pulled me aside and said. But then saying that, in our last year of school, the last year we'd ever been played at school, we had a cup final against his year, had a cup final, and he scored a hat-trick. He scored a hat-trick, and I scored four, and we beat them 4-3. So he went to cheat for Nevin and Tom Ward. We won that at, what's that field, George White's down off? Blackwell's Road. Yeah, right there. That was the stadium. Yeah, we beat him. So if there's any footage out there and anyone's got it, I'd love to see the clips of that one because, yeah, that was a happy call. So, well, for the level you're saying you're playing at, unfortunately, you didn't make it pro, so you didn't go where you wanted to go. So back into that. So let's just say it didn't go because of the injury. It didn't go where it should have went. So now you're 15, 16. Yeah, it wasn't really just because of the injury. I suppose if I really would have, but what I'm trying to say is when I wasn't playing football, my head was turned into other avenues. I was always wanting to get money and be quite, I'm trying to say, buy the clothes that my mum couldn't afford to buy me. You get what I'm trying to say? All the other little things that come with grand. So how would you be getting, let's say if your mum's working, she's going to afford it. That's real. We know we can really relate to that. So what was your thinking to maybe get- Yeah, I used to just find little avenues to get money, innit? Cool. Let me just stop you there. Let me quick stop you there. See, when you was young, you went up in it a couple of years up, yeah? That's what he's explaining to me. Then you go from, boom, you go to school, you turn into like, I'm listening to you, innit? So you're kind of, you know, I mean, you've come, they're paying you to protect people. So you've got some form of, you know what I mean? You've got influence. You're not madman, but you're not a bully because you never see yourself as a bully because you was taking on people. So you justified how you was getting your stuff up. This is my opinion. So now you're going to be 16, playing football, but after football, I'm getting you playing football, after football, you're doing other little stuff. Yeah, but I grew up in a quite, like it was always like a community, more than like how I find the road to be now. There was like a lot more emphasis on community. So then like, for instance,
Even now, what I'm going to say to you now, see if I'm going to put you at 16, it's not saying it's rare, because you're, how old are you? Who, now? As of now, how old are you? Yeah, I'm 51, 52 next year. So you're 52 next year, so if I take you straight to 52, you're going to, yeah, so if you can, I don't need to be 16. Do you know what I'm saying? Keep yourself at 16, I want to dance, I want to de-stress, not forget what's going on today right now, even though we have to relate like that 100%, because we want to teach the kids, I'm trying to get things from you, where anyone watching, or kids, like, might have even, relating to your story as far as we've gone now, they can relate in it, do you understand, I don't need to miss anything that might be able to help them, so they don't, not to say the football thing, because there's so much that is positive already, listening to you, do you understand, so it can't be all bad in it, but I just want to know where you're heading now, like 16, at 16, not the man who you just told me your age, 16, you want clothes, you've got influences, you named a few names on the chair, a few friends that understand, do you understand what I'm trying to say?
